Hello, im new and wondered if anyone can tell me how long it takes to train to be a tailor and when can you actually call yourself a tailor?
I am a very mature third year fashion technology student and i was a machinist for a few years many many years ago. I can pattern cut and sew to a very high standard, good hand sewing skills but never used a thimble on my middle finger, so im learning this as i type. I need to improve my welts and jets but they arent the worst. I have alterations experience also and make 1960s dresses in my spare time.
Im about to complete a 360 hour placement at a tailors as this is the route i would like to take for my future.
I have found out that the gentleman who owns the business has been trying to retire for a few years with no interest in a successor, his staff are nearing retirement age also. I think its the last working tailor in my town and it is very sad news for the industry.
My idea when i start and they have agreed is to practice stitches, padding and pockets etc. I will then draft a suit for a friend which they will assist me to do. I will also take stuff home with me as i am keen to learn as much as possible and will use your forum to help me.
Does it sound too outrageous that i would love to take over his business? Perhaps in a year. Any replies greatly appreciated. Many thanks
What part of the world are we talking Julieh?
Im in Scotland. He has a steady client base, but i haven't looked at his books yet as I've not started. I have my own ideas of to bring the business up to date also. Thank you.
I guess when you get to the point where the people in that business think you are operating on the level they are operating and are willing to let you work for customers, you are then the tailor.
This is unclear to me though:
QuoteI'm about to complete a 360 hour placement
What does that mean? Six hours a day for two months? Three hours a day for four months? Eight hours a day for a month and a half?
I don't understand why anything past 24 hours is measured in hours.
We have to complete the 360 hours before the end of the semester by the end of April. I assume its in hours as most students have responsibilities like jobs etc so telling us to do specific days wont work for most, giving hours over a 15 week period gives flexibility to the students. I plan to do four days a week, standard 7.5 hours a day, longer if i can. Im not officially finished studying until the end of May so will stay on as long as i can.
Yeah, i suppose you're right, they will decide if my work is up to scratch. I think i just wanted to clarify if my dream was realistic as i know saville row apprentices take up to five years and that's with a diploma, but as you say, my work will be the decider.
I second Henry Halls comment, I would look at their stuff next. Can you find out their reputation?
I think there is constant learning to be done, but you would have to reach a level that they feel is adequate. No one wants to pass on their successful business and reputation to someone who will not succeed.
Make sure you get frank and honest feedback about the quality of your work.
Great comment Terri.
Quote from: Schneiderfrei on January 14, 2019, 12:04:09 AM
I second Henry Halls comment, I would look at their stuff next. Can you find out their reputation?
I think their reputation is pretty sound. Sir Sean Connery being their most notable client.
Quote from: TTailor on January 14, 2019, 01:01:06 AM
I think there is constant learning to be done, but you would have to reach a level that they feel is adequate. No one wants to pass on their successful business and reputation to someone who will not succeed.
Make sure you get frank and honest feedback about the quality of your work.
Thank you Terri, yes, i totally agree, you never fully learn anything in construction and sewing. I would not want to ruin the reputation of the business and im willing to do the extra to get up to speed, meet the clients and build a rapport with them. Im sure the owner is secretly delighted i turned up, he knows im very passionate.
I understand the business has been established for over 50 years with the current owner taking over around 30 years ago, he told me who trained him and i assume he worked there and then bought it. I think the previous owner is still living as he said he had a young man going in who had worked in alterations and they were both training him, but he left, i am assuming he didnt realise the complexity of the work involved. Why would you leave, its a business ready to be handed over.
I shall delve deeper when i start next week. Thank you for all of your feedback.
Sounds like a decent opportunity worth working for.
Yeah, sounds Good.
The only other thing is are you prepared for changes in the profession, market, in the foreseeable future. That is not to discourage, but you might need a conscious and strong plan to push yourself/company forward. I expect that is not a new idea for you anyway.
What do you think?
Quote from: Schneiderfrei on January 15, 2019, 10:55:22 AM
The only other thing is are you prepared for changes in the profession, market, in the foreseeable future. That is not to discourage, but you might need a conscious and strong plan to push yourself/company forward. I expect that is not a new idea for you anyway.
What do you think?
Im not sure what you mean by changing markets?
Obviously his current clientele have went there for years and are older. The business needs a complete re-haul, brand identity that will include my own ideas, a website, (they dont have email), clever marketing to attract new customers including women. I assume most of the fabric is sourced in the uk, which i will stringently continue to do, i would think only cashmere and merino are sourced overseas.
yes, i plan to meet with both textile scotland and creative scotland before i draft my plan. My aunt had a chain of businesses who will also be on hand with the books etc.
My main priority at the moment is to intensely learn tailoring skills and build myself an excellent reputation. He wants the business to continue hence why he's still there but after four years has given up on a buyer, and then i turn up!
Bizarre thing is at my other placement today i met the only other bespoke tailor in my area who has just given up business, he's doing adhoc alterations. I think hed be a valuable connection to have for the future.
Marketing....'brand identity'... I don't know, it seems to be a curse for tailoring establishments. Gieves & Hawkes went down that route big time and now they appear more like a rtw gents' outfitters. Some of the clothes they sell (or have on sale?) look like clothes from H&M.
Certainly there's nothing wrong with attracting a younger, broader range of clientele, though I'm never sure whether the people attracted by the marketing spiel fully understand what they are responding to. On the whole it strikes me that those tailoring establishments (particularly in the UK) which have gone 'mainstream' have very much diluted their 'brand' rather than enhanced it. Not to mention the rather spurious offshoot operations like 'Henry Poole, China'.
Quote from: Henry Hall on January 16, 2019, 05:41:28 AM
Marketing....'brand identity'... I don't know, it seems to be a curse for tailoring establishments. Gieves & Hawkes went down that route big time and now they appear more like a rtw gents' outfitters. Some of the clothes they sell (or have on sale?) look like clothes from H&M.
By brand identity, i mean giving it an actual identity, giving it a makeover, a logo, getting the name out there again, letting people know about the last bespoke tailor of its kind in the area. The current decor is wood panelling dated 1970s or 80s, not my favourite vintage decor. Greaves and hawkes are in London, they are rich, im not and im in scotland, we have a completely different market and style to London.
Like i said, i haven't started yet and i started this thread for feedback on tailoring skills and ability, i.e time i should spend concentrating on certain tasks etc. I will leave my business ideas for the moment as i have a lot to concentrate on skills wise. If things dont go to plan then ill continue to focus on my other visions and ill have gained excellent experience from a master tailor, still all good either way.
My apologies, gieves and hawkes.
To me this is about tradition and heritage, i don't want want that shop to die and be replaced with a charity shop or phone fixing shop or another coffee shop, that's all.
Julieh - not to discourage you but what I think everyone is trying to bring to your attention is the fact that the clientele for bespoke clothing is basically dying off. In prior times young professional men may have struggled for a few bespoke suits while the older established gentleman would have maintained a wardrobe sufficient to denote his status and success. These days men, both young and old, use their toys to denote status. Young men have the latest I-phone, flashiest auto, coolest vacations - older men have bigger boats, second and third homes, second and third vehicles...(second and third wives) and most men are dressed in a quality of polo shirt and khakis that denotes their social standing.
Many tailors still operating must do alterations just to keep the lights on and food on the table.
So as you are honing your skills, it would probably be beneficial to understand who you are marketing to before worrying about the marketing itself. Quite frankly, with the extremely poor quality of RTW clothing available to women these days at virtually all price points, I would think the executive female market would be of interest. If she can be convinced to spend $1200 - $2400 on a designer label (that mostly only impresses her female underlings), then can she be convinced to spend the necessary amount to overpower the men she meets with next in the conference room?
These types of decisions should have bearing on the focus of your training.
Hmm. Don't think you know what bespoke tailoring is. It's a different way of making clothes. It is different because of the way people think about clothes. Therefore, how they are made. Most people only know a little about mass market production and expect that sort of manufacture, which is a completely different. Today the word bespoke is polluted. But the people who want the old word, bespoke, are going to walk out very quickly when they find out your not it. Then, all your customers are gone, because that is the only kind of customers they have.
You can start a brand if you like in another room with another name so you don't scare away your bread and butter customers. It is best to have a different name for it, too.
When there were lots of tailors some had several business. For the high priced. Middle-class. And last, but not least, teenagers. Keeping these customers separate by using different doors, or different places in town, brought in more customers. A smaller town with fewer tailors and customers can schedule their customers according to wealth and age. For example, teenagers on Monday's.
Some small town tailors make many kinds of garments to stay in business. My granddad could make any kind of garment. I watched him explain every detail of making a coat from perhaps the1350s. This one boy of 11 that I went to school with went to a local tailor and got a simple school coat. Not expensive. Another boy just out of high school went to a local tailor for a special coat made and the old tailor told him about making clothes for about every fad that came around the bend in his life time. Don't have to be a stuffy old tailor only making "tailored" clothes. But your image to your customers matters, as I explained different doors, different rooms and even different locations, so not to lose customers.
What I like about tailors making so many kinds of garments, one offs, at that, is they are not elementary garments. There education (apprenticeship) added so much knowledge. Better pattern, better fit, better concept of the fad, style, whatever. I've seen lousy tailors who should have been doing something else with their life. But the best tailors leave a lot to marvel about when seeing people wearing these clothes that they made.
I think what you want is not brand and other unworthy associations, but recognition of making the best for the wealthy and those who have less. When teenagers discover that they are part of the fashion design team, who wants to go to the store to try and find something that will never be as good? The tailor who made for the 11 year old boy just looked at him, a few measurements, of course, found out what was wanted, and drew the pattern on the cloth, cut out with inlays for fitting, do the fitting, sew it up and press- finished. Cost a little more than unfitted store bought pre-made garbage. A sports coat can have a canvas put in on the bias with less details to bring the cost down. Some guys never use hip pockets on the coat. A flap there nobody except the owner is going to know. There are ways to bring the cost down and still have a nice coat. A good fit is important. Other stuff varies according to price. Thousands of hand stitches will run the cost up, as more details add to the cost for those who want them. Make what people will pay for.
True bespoke is top brand identity. You don't have to make a fake one. True bespoke gives you and the customer freedom and liberty, whereas, brand identity, that you are thinking of, will take that away, because it is in a different business category.