selvage denim trouser fitting

[TTailor]

Denim jeans are not drafted like trousers.

Was coming here to say the same thing.

[Gerry]

No they're not drafted like trousers, but they can be! 

The reason why the French and people like Bill Green started cutting jeans like trousers in the 1950s, was because of the limitations of the traditional cut.

I have a pair of designer jeans purchased in the early 90s. They're cut like a pair of 1950s trousers, albeit with a yolk. That's when I stopped wearing 501s, they were just a superior fit and style. They're a little tired now, so I just wear them for DIY jobs, but if I ever desire to wear jeans again I'll clone them.

[Chanterelle]

However, I would consider repositioning the leg to avoid drag lines if that's an issue, though it would mean abandoning the selvedge idea. Though you'll need to sort out the fork first to make an evaluation, because its tightness is distorting the cloth a fair bit (difficult to know if some of those drag lines are from the fork or the wide leg spacing ... or both).

I have too much selvage denim on hand to abandon the selvage idea, unfortunately. I'm not opposed to a bit of diaper butt, haha, nor to a bit of drag. But do want the excessive drag to go.

That said, I extended the fork as you said previously and that seems to have sorted out most of the drag lines. will update with an image when possible.

Thanks for your help--and continued effort to help!

[Chanterelle]

Super helpful to visualize. Think I may need to add some more fullness to the CB seam, given these images. But I'd like your take when I update with the new draft

[Chanterelle]

I personally would put in a western style front pockets.

The pocket style I prefer is a straight slant, nearly horizontal...gives a bit of western without being constume-y I think.

[Chanterelle]

Denim jeans are not drafted like trousers.

Was coming here to say the same thing.

The problem I have with a standard denim draft is that I get the excessive drag. I'll upload a pic of me wearing store bought denim to show. Hence the major scoop in the CB seam. The problem the scoop creates is an issue with makeup...the two back panels come together in an extreme point, with excessive angle down the first few inches of the back inseam

[Hendrick]

I personally would put in a western style front pockets.

The pocket style I prefer is a straight slant, nearly horizontal...gives a bit of western without being constume-y I think.

These are usually referred to as "Sta-press" pockets. Patched front pockets with a diagonal opening as "engineers-pockets", 4-patch pocket jeans as "ship mates", front western style pockets as "revolver pockets", curved vertical pockets as "banana pockets", Levi style patched back pockets as "spade pockets". And actually, James Dean wore 505's instead of 501's; the construction is similar but they have a zipper fly instead of buttons and a narrower bottom leg...

Cheers, Hendrick

[Greger]

Don't forget Seafares!

[Chanterelle]

Do you have the draft system for selvage? Would you mind sharing?

[Chanterelle]

Not sure but this looks to me manifestly worse than the original. Had to do some playing around with the pattern.

Since it's loom state denim, it will shrink quite a bit when washed, so I needed to raise the rise especially because it will shrink with the grain. hard to draft for shrinkage.

What I'm noticing is excess fabric down the front leg...I cut into the front curve to minimize, but now the overall crotch curve looks to me too short, hence drag lines.

Looking also like I need to scoop the back crotch curve more to eliminate the excess between the legs/seat.

input always welcome...just at a forever loss...can't get the fit I like with the style I want: a 'regular' straight fit, without too much taper, but avoids those pesky back drag lines.

[Gerry]

Really you should have pre shrunk your cloth before cutting it. It's not too late. Leave it to soak in hot water, dry, press then reassemble. How can you make judgments regarding fit when you don't know how much it's going to shrink by?

[Greger]

A jeans pattern
https://web.archive.org/web/20130413014621/http://www.cutterandtailor.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2196&st=0&p=21477&hl=+jeans%20+making&fromsearch=1&#entry21477
And a pair cut from it.
https://web.archive.org/web/20130512074416/http://www.cutterandtailor.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3219

[Greger]

Something about Trews





They are one piece. So most the side seam is straight.
Shape is pressed in.

[Gerry]

From the Trews article:

To preserve the perpendicular position of the front centre stripe ... is one of the most important features of the cutting, and as large or prominent knee bones often force the stripe out of position ... cutters make it a rule to allow an inlay right through the leg seams on the top side.

This is what I was banging on about in the narrow-trousers thread a while ago. It's the first time I've seen it in print, though. Most tailors are unaware of this problem because they're averse to cutting narrow-leg trousers and never encounter it. The knobbly part of the inner knee displaces the mathematical centre of the knee (different from the actual centre of the joint), so if the leg is too snug in this area the centre creases are pulled inwards.

[Gerry]

Getting things back on track: thoughts about the fit. They're not bad from the front, just a little baggy/full at the back. If you shrink the cloth as suggested, some of that may disappear. If not, then reduce some of the ease across the back and thighs. Don't be tempted to do all this by adjusting the fork widths though.