Wages on Savile Row

[SewGenerously]

Hi there-

Does anybody here have any insight into what a tailor (in any position) on Savile Row makes on an hourly or salary basis? I'm simply trying to wrap my head around how the houses on the Row can sell 100+ hours of labor+materials+overhead and still profit at £4,500. Even paying their tailors minimum wage of about £10/hour, that comes to minimum £1,000 just for labor (and it's hard to assume there are enough tailors about for them to be paying minimum wage).

Anybody have any firsthand insight?

Thanks!

[Schneiderfrei]

What a great question.

[TTailor]

That is a good question.
Fabrics are usually included in pricing I believe.

It would also be interesting how many hours are allotted to each garment for sewing purposes.

Process list

Fabrics and materials such as lining, canvas thread buttons, etc
Pattern making
Cutting
Delivery to various tailors for making up if they are not in house
Baste ups
Return to cutter for fitting
Fitting
Tear downs and marking alterations
Delivery to tailor
Sewing - how finished are the garments at this stage?
Return to cutter
Fitting maybe this is a final fitting? But there could be one more....
Garments to finisher
Finishing- buttonholes and buttons, etc - not sure what is left to finishers
Plus
Office type work, taxes emails advertising etc
Overhead -rent, heat hydro, equipment maintenue and repairs, general maintenance  etc

[Gerry]

No idea what staff are paid. However, a few things spring to mind:

Businesses just need to stay afloat. They're not necessarily looking to expand and monopolise markets. So long as everyone gets paid and the rent is met, that's good enough. IIR, in Richard Anderson's Bespoke book he mentions that Huntsman had a period of barely breaking even.

Saville Row suits can cost more than £4,500.

Outlets sell stuff on premises other than bespoke to keep profits healthy: shirts, ties, cufflinks etc.

I can think of at least one firm that franchised their name in the far east, lending it to off-the-peg suits cut in their style. And a number of tailoring firms across London sell off-the-peg suits (which can be altered on premises) alongside their bespoke service. All helps with their profits.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/15/business/savile-row-covid.html

[TSjursen]

Most of the firms don't make huge profits, some are barely surviving breaking even or are practically not profitable and living off investor/benefactors instead. £4500 is in the lower range of Savile Row starting prices. "Starts at" is also a very fluid concept and I would hazard a guess that most suits end up being more expensive than that. I'm also pretty sure only the "cheapest" fabric options are included in that price.

Many London firms rely on outworkers, and they are paid per piece. Even firms with their own workshops often have tailors who are not on salaries, and they may not even be employed by the firm. Another factor here is time. It does not take 100 hours to make a bespoke suit, unless the working method employed is extraordinarily inefficient or we are talking about some pretty over the top detailing or special requirements. I know the savile row association thing specifies 60 hours minimum, but I'm pretty sure that in most cases takes into account the cutting and fitting as well as the actual sewing. I've seen many time logs from the early 1900s to the 50s/60s, and they all hover around 40-45 hours for a three piece with first class handwork. Even if you're that quick I still think, for many, being a tailor for a Savile Row firm is long hours for comparatively little money.

[Schneiderfrei]

What a great break-down TSjursen.  Sounds pretty realistic.

[hutch--]

Fabric costs for a high end suit are very high. Years ago I repaired a number of shears for a guy who worked at a high end tailor and among other things I was given a collection of offcuts of some Holland and Sherry suit material that was in the vicinity of UK pounds, 500 pounds a yard. It was not big enough to do anything useful with so I made a pair of stubbies out of the offcuts. Probably the most expensive pair of stubbies on the planet. 

[Schneiderfrei]

Hutch, you and stubbies, Ha ha.

That was my uniform when I was 16 to 19 years old.

G

[TheEssexTailor]

Hi

Well as a striker, was paid £25,000 starting wages per annum

[anastasia_gr]

Hi

Well as a striker, was paid £25,000 starting wages per annum

Excuse my ignorance, but what is a striker?

[TheEssexTailor]

Hi

Well as a striker, was paid £25,000 starting wages per annum

Excuse my ignorance, but what is a striker?

A striker is someone who marks the patterns in and cuts them out.

[anastasia_gr]

Hi

Well as a striker, was paid £25,000 starting wages per annum

Excuse my ignorance, but what is a striker?

A striker is someone who marks the patterns in and cuts them out.

Ah ok, but the patterns are made by someone else?

[Der Zuschneider]

Most of the firms don't make huge profits, some are barely surviving breaking even or are practically not profitable and living off investor/benefactors instead. £4500 is in the lower range of Savile Row starting prices. "Starts at" is also a very fluid concept and I would hazard a guess that most suits end up being more expensive than that. I'm also pretty sure only the "cheapest" fabric options are included in that price.

Many London firms rely on outworkers, and they are paid per piece. Even firms with their own workshops often have tailors who are not on salaries, and they may not even be employed by the firm. Another factor here is time. It does not take 100 hours to make a bespoke suit, unless the working method employed is extraordinarily inefficient or we are talking about some pretty over the top detailing or special requirements. I know the savile row association thing specifies 60 hours minimum, but I'm pretty sure that in most cases takes into account the cutting and fitting as well as the actual sewing. I've seen many time logs from the early 1900s to the 50s/60s, and they all hover around 40-45 hours for a three piece with first class handwork. Even if you're that quick I still think, for many, being a tailor for a Savile Row firm is long hours for comparatively little money.

I believe 60h could be minimum but I would think 80 to 100h is more realistic. There is no money to make if you don't sell at 6000$. They tailor a suit here for 3000$. I have not clue how they survive here in Houston.

[TheEssexTailor]

Hi

Well as a striker, was paid £25,000 starting wages per annum

Excuse my ignorance, but what is a striker?

A striker is someone who marks the patterns in and cuts them out.

Ah ok, but the patterns are made by someone else?

Correct, usually by the head cutter or undercutter if he's competent enough

[Gerry]

Richard Anderson's book "Bespoke" gives a good breakdown of the practices and hierarchy of Saville Row. It's pretty funny too.