Hand-sewn button holes for trousers?

[Gerry]

Thanks Greger, that's the sort of thing I needed to know. 

I'm just making causal stuff at the moment, because the material is cheaper, so anything too showy would look daft.

[Futura]

There's a company in the UK that reconditions old singers (they come with a certificate for electrical compliance etc). All reasonably priced.

Are they by any chance an eBay seller? I know of a few on there selling "refurbished" sewing machines claiming to be PAT tested and they were not compliant. They literally slapped stickers on anything, including incomplete parts that cannot be tested. I would not trust their work. (I also don't trust most repairmen. Better to fix it yourself.)

[Gerry]

There's a company in the UK that reconditions old singers (they come with a certificate for electrical compliance etc). All reasonably priced.

Are they by any chance an eBay seller? I know of a few on there selling "refurbished" sewing machines claiming to be PAT tested and they were not compliant. They literally slapped stickers on anything, including incomplete parts that cannot be tested. I would not trust their work. (I also don't trust most repairmen. Better to fix it yourself.)

Yes, they're on eBay. Oh well, I'll give them a wide berth.

Re my repairman, by the sound of things his assessment was right. He didn't think that removing the knob would get to the root of the problem, it would only damage the appearance. Obviously, he took one look at my shambolic surrounds, sized me up, and (correctly) figured that I wouldn't want the expense of a full repair ... especially when I confirmed that I seldom used zig-zag.

Perhaps he was being lazy, but he did give me a good tip by telling me to use synthetic motor oil. I can hear when my machine needs oiling, which is a fraction of what it used to be (the stuff lubricates for ages). No doubt someone will tell me it will cause my nuts to drop off, but he was right.

[Schneiderfrei]

Hi MukPuk,

I expect peterle is well aware of the factors you have raised in relation to silk.  Many people reading this forum have no idea that the enzymes in standard washing liquids will actually dissolve silk, wool and other protiens.

It was a good general warning.

G

[Gerry]

There's a company in the UK that reconditions old singers (they come with a certificate for electrical compliance etc). All reasonably priced.

Are they by any chance an eBay seller? I know of a few on there selling "refurbished" sewing machines claiming to be PAT tested and they were not compliant. They literally slapped stickers on anything, including incomplete parts that cannot be tested. I would not trust their work. (I also don't trust most repairmen. Better to fix it yourself.)

Yes, they're on eBay. Oh well, I'll give them a wide berth.

Re my repairman, by the sound of things his assessment was right. He didn't think that removing the knob would get to the root of the problem, it would only damage the appearance. Obviously, he took one look at my shambolic surrounds, sized me up, and (correctly) figured that I wouldn't want the expense of a full repair ... especially when I confirmed that I seldom used zig-zag.

Perhaps he was being lazy, but he did give me a good tip by telling me to use synthetic motor oil. I can hear when my machine needs oiling, which is a fraction of what it used to be (the stuff lubricates for ages). No doubt someone will tell me it will cause my nuts to drop off, but he was right.

No,no, no, no, no and once more.

DO NOT use synthetic motor oil to lubricate sewing machines. There are dopes in that oil that are not only very toxic, but it will dissolve just about any sort of paint, rubber, felt and fibre- and particle board not specifically formulated to stand up to them. That includes shellack and wire insulation. Good luck have fun with an all metal sewing machine and live electrics.

If that weren't just the worst, it gets slightly worse still.

White oil (SMO = Sewing Machine Oil" or LMO = Light Machine Oil" or WMO ="White Machine Oil" same stuff under other names) has a very specific viscosity (54 cubic mm/second at 20 degrees C) and it creeps where it needs to be in fine machinery. Motor oil is much thicker and needs to be heated before it flows well. It cannot form a capillary film over finely polished surfaces and doesn't in fact lubricate because these oils need a certain pressure to actually lubricate. Pushing around slippery stuff isn't lubrication. It's pushing slippery stuff around and in some cases, it can't even reach the parts that are very finely fitted because it's too bloody thick. Like, almost everywhere in a Bernina. Btw, do that to your overlocker, with all those nice plastic bits, and you'll be looking at a lot of plastic goop in no time at all.

Besides all that, SMO doesn't "gum up" when it comes into contact with air. Motor oils do. Have fun cleaning that gunk out.

This sort of advice comes from hear-say and a total lack of any knowledge. Yes, some INDUSTRIAL machines use specialist oils, like many sump-pump lubricated Union Specials (especially the 2nd and 3rd gen 50000 series) that really like medium weight hydraulic oil, and some Singer (and clones) off-the arm machines that require a slightly heavier white machine oil due to their free-flow lubrication system. But none of these are even remotely comparable to a household Bernina and none use "motor oil". If you truly believe mechanical devices work as generic as that, I suggest you put diesel fuel in your petrol car (or the other way around, that's really going to be ... smashing) next time you go get your tank filled, and see how that works out for you. They're both hydrocarbons after all, what could possibly the difference and what could possibly go wrong? Right?

Use the appropriate stuff and find other mechanic, this one clearly has no idea what he's doing or talking about.

As I thought (currently sewing my nuts back on).

Thankfully, I haven't used any in my over-locker. It came with oil and I've been using that.

The Bernina is a totally metal interior and the electrics are separate from anywhere that is oiled. So I doubt it's damaged anything.

Will go back to using normal machine oil. Thanks for your sage advice.

As for my repair guy, it was a couple of years ago when he came round. Haven't needed to call him (or anyone else) since then. Fingers crossed things remain that way for a good few years.

[hutch--]

I have the same Elna machines as peterle and I use a trick combination of Singer sewing machine oil and a teflon additive designed for car gearboxes and it works really well, super clean and they run almost silent. Funny part is they run a lot faster and if you run them at full speed they almost walk off the table.

For any machine, look up the manufacturers specs, especially an industrial with a sump then get the most modern oil that matches the spec. If you have ever had to clean out a machine that used the old stuff, you will know why.

[Gerry]

I have the same Elna machines as peterle and I use a trick combination of Singer sewing machine oil and a teflon additive designed for car gearboxes and it works really well, super clean and they run almost silent.

I'll go back to using normal machine oil, as recommended by MukPuk (if Syn. Motor Oil is toxic, I want no part of it). I have to say though, my machine does run better on the stuff (though probably not in the long run, by the sound of things).

[Futura]

Many people highly recommend Tri-Flow oil, which contains Teflon. I used it in one of my household machines and it stayed lubricated and happy longer than with just plain sewing machine oil.

I have noticed a difference in quality between oil sold in large quantities for industrial sewing versus the tiny retail bottles. I found the industrial grade oil to be very light, odorless and inoffensive. The last bottle of household Singer branded sewing machine oil I bought smelled awful.

I would keep any kind of oil away from plastic parts (nylon etc). I have seen numerous broken plastic gears due to inappropriate oiling.

Best of luck getting your Bernina repaired, or finding another machine you like. I have had a lot of success buying vintage machines off of eBay and Gumtree "as is," but it does require some hunting and often a few repairs.

[hutch--]

With the two Elnas I have they have a nylon bevel gear down under the bobbin area and it responds well to the light oil/teflon brew that I use with them, the drop of friction amidst other parts makes the machines run faster, quieter and a lot smoother and this much with these 1960s Elnas, you oil them regularly.

I hunted up a couple of plastic bottles that have a very fine tube about the diameter of a syringe and it makes it easy to access even really difficult areas.

As far as the generic term plastic, there are plastics and there are plastics and many of them have no relation to each other at all. When you have dangerous materials like acids and a variety of other toxic or corrosive chemicals supplied in plastic containers, simplified generalisations don't mean much.

I have seen a multitude of different lubricants that are suitable for domestic sewing machines, auto transmission fluid, synthetic motor oils in the viscosity range of 10 - 30 (which I used to use in the gearbox of high performance motorbikes) and almost all of the types I have mentioned live in an environment of heat, pressure that have a variety of seals to prevent leakage.

You obviously don't use heavy engine oil as sewing machines don't generate enough heat to reduce its viscosity but any high quality lubricant that is SAE 10 or lighter will work OK and will not gum up the works like the very old oils did.

[Greger]

Some tailors put the stitching close and some are really far apart.
I like the knots in a straight row next to each other. That is how close I put the stitches. And never tight stitches.

[Gerry]

You obviously don't use heavy engine oil as sewing machines don't generate enough heat to reduce its viscosity but any high quality lubricant that is SAE 10 or lighter will work OK and will not gum up the works like the very old oils did.

The synthetic oil I own is low viscosity: "5W". From what I understand, the W stands for winter and viscosity increases with heat - it being lower at cold temperatures to ensure start up in the winter. Seems a little counterintuitive, as you'd expect it to thin out with temperature. But assuming that's right, a domestic machine will never generate enough heat for things to seriously gum up. Or have I misunderstood?

What I do know is that my machine runs more smoothly, so the oil must be reaching all the necessary parts. Plus the interior is 100% metal, the electrics being bolted on the back as a separate unit. I just don't fancy the 'toxic' aspect of this oil.

[Gerry]

Some tailors put the stitching close and some are really far apart.
I like the knots in a straight row next to each other. That is how close I put the stitches. And never tight stitches.

Although I have no experience of handsewn buttonholes, I like that look too.

[spookietoo]

Gerry, I'm using Triflow on all of my machines that need oil, all ages, no problem. It has teflon. Will cut thru old gunky gelatanized machine oil, break it down and lubricate. Not sure if it's available in the UK, but its sold in all bicycle stores here in the states. Comes with the skinny straw tube with makes application a breeze when you buy a 2 oz bottle. Worth every penny. My Mom's memory is getting a bit "iffy" and just recently discovered she's been using Three-in-One oil on her best machine. Horribly nasty gunk! It's getting a Triflow treatment one night this week.

As for your zigzag.....my late 80's Janome seized up completely a couple of years ago. It was sewing fine one day and the next, it would only sew straight stitches and none of the stitch selector knobs would budge. Width, type, length - all stuck. With nothing to lose I opened up the right side of the machine (not discussed anywhere in my owners manual) and there was a marvelous set of all metal gears, showing small amounts of the remnants of lithium grease. Of course the poor thing just needed a really thorough lube job! I slowly worked lithium grease in between all of the gears - took about an hour and a half. If a part of your machine needs grease, oil shouldn't be used there. The parts are machined using tolerances designed for oil or grease.

[Gerry]

Gerry, I'm using Triflow on all of my machines that need oil, all ages, no problem.

That's good info, thanks. In the end I ordered some Liberty Oil, which is synthetic but designed for sewing machines. When that runs out, I'll try some Triflow for comparison (in the UK it's slightly cheaper, by the look of things).

Re my Bernina, every bit is viewable/accessible by removing the top lid. I really think it would have to be taken apart to solve the problem; and no doubt I'd end up with a box of spare parts after reassembling it, so I'll pass.

I've only started using zig-zag (for when overlooking is a little too thick, and can be felt through the material), and the default settings work out OK. Plus the Bernina was given to me, so I can work around its limitations. 

[spookietoo]

My BIL is a mechanical genius of sorts - pretty much nothing he can't fix. He's a ME at a major nuclear defense contractor and is now a VP after 35+ years. When I asked him for lithium grease, he got so excited to show me his collection - seriously excited.

I chose the newest looking container (I know him - throws NOTHING away - one of those containers could easily be older than my machine!) He did however have a can of "Spray lithium" - again with the skinny straw. He explained it's not as good as the solid lithium but sometimes you just can't get to what you need to do. I did use it on one spot, which I can actually access with a longer artist brush instead of a q-tip - all I had that day.

Might very well be worth getting a can of the spray stuff for your issues as using the machine dry could do irreparable harm - even if you think you're not using certain gears/parts.

But I understand what you mean about tearing something down. Luckily my Kenmore recuperated completely without a tear down.

I have a 15-88 treadle that needs a complete paint job. The Japaning has extensive rust underneath causing huge chunks of the finish to fall off. The machine is otherwise in excellent working order, having been refurbed 25 or so years ago. (I suspect a cleaning agent caused harm to the japaning as none of the mechanics are rusty - very weird actually)

I plan on disassembling completely (a lá Eric Wengstrom on YouTube- amazing repaints!) and attempting all reassembly myself - but most likely I'll just show up at BIL's front door some Sunday with a pretty, shiny piece of vintage mechanics in need of knowledgeable TLC. I'll get the same response as handing free crack cocaine to an addict - total elation - he just can't help himself!

BIL keeps a 1968 olive green refrigerator for beer in the 3-1/2 car garage of his 5000 sq ft home - just to see how long he can keep it running. Hasn't had to work on it for years. He acquired it from a rental house just after he and my sis married - he replaced the compressor then.

Everyone should be so lucky to have such talent in the family!