shirt drafting, forward collar

[posaune]

I attach a corpulent draft. (I take this for sleepwear or piquee shirts.). Maybe it clears things a bit up
lg
posaune

[Kiem]

Here I did the forward shoulder alteration and added to the CF at waistline.
Forgot to take a back picture...

I basted on some sleeves I had laying around, adjusted for sloping side through the natural shoulder line for now to check if my measurements are correct.

Oh and I added some darts to see what would happen.

My brain is spinning around from all the info.
                                           

[Kiem]

Is that the method you were describing for slashing and pivoting?

Image on the left.

[peterle]

 How do you like it?! How does it feel? Can you move your arms forward? The "balance" problems are gone now I think.
My proposal is, not to take out that much in the back dart; first because a deep dart causes ripples because of the uncut darted fabric, and second because it looks a bit to tight proportionally for my taste. A big dart also pronounces the round back. Taking out just a bit is often enough to get a slim silhouette, you don´t need to make it skintight.

Roughly yes to the left pic, but I would run the short part into the armhole, not the side seam. And I would add a lot less in your case.

[Kiem]

I am still a bit unsure what I think of it.
Movability seems fine, though I didn't have much problems with my other shirts. I think I might need to test this in a final trial shirt with proper sleeves and collar sewn on.

I do see a big improvement in how the shoulders fit, so I am happy with that.

I think I need to widen the across back measurement. Probably 2 cm's each side.
The back armscye lies on the back, not where the arm meets the back muscles.

Are front and back side seams kept symmetrical in shirts?

I added 2 cm front balance in this muslin.
Though when I measured my balance i measured 0,5 cm front balance needed. Then again my measurements could be off due to me having to take them by myself.

I keep having some creases coming from the shoulder blade to below the armhole.
This disappears when I push some of the cloth at the side seam towards the back. Seems I need a bit less suppression at the back waist.
In the problem figur topic, they talked about a hollow back, and letting out the back waist seam by 5 mm and supressing the centre back 5 mm extra. This seems to move the waist ring forward a bit on the back pattern. I think I might need to do this on my waistcoats as well at some point.

[peterle]

Since there is no back pic, I can´t see wether the back is too narrow. But the folds at the front armhole seam indicate, that it could be good to shift the whole armhole a tad towards the front (about 1cm?) This would also enlargen the back. So keep the shoulder tips where they are, shift the lower part of the armhole forward (on the chest line) and reconnect with the shoulder tips. Keep the side seam also where it is.

You cant surpress the CB waist, because there is no CB seam on a shirt. Because your hip is in the norm position (vertical with the shoulderblades) You also can´t pinch out the back (same as in front but overlapping instead of opening) because you need the width  at the hip. (When your hip were forward too, you could pinch the back).

[Kiem]

When I have the change I'll ask someone to help me take front chest and back width measurements.

Should any ease be added when using these direct measurements into a pattern?
I want to learn how to do that eventually anyway.

I had taken the sleeves off and marked the waistline more clearly.

[posaune]

I see that your front is still rising. I attach a pic how I would tackle the problem. But I do not know if Peterle agrees because the front armhole is now straighter.
lg posaune

[peterle]

Well, I´m not sure why the shirt seems to have a shorter front now. The balance in the pics with sleeves looked so much better. Also the side seam was running straight. In the newer pics it does not. Is it a balance problem? Or is the shirt not worn as it should?

Posaune, I´m not sure I get your sketch right: slashing the chestline, open it at the CF, keeping the old centerline, and remove the difference between old and new CF-line at the side seam?

[posaune]

Only the last part, Peterle. That should be a possibility -  if it causes a "pregnant" look to took at side seam some of it out again.
lg
posaune

[Hendrick]

Hi All,

I have been following this from the early beginning; kudos for Kiem for your perseverance. It is very interesting to follow. In my, albeit limited, wisdom as a "ladies man" (fitwise that is) I would slash the pattern from the centerpoint like you did, but I would slash it towards the forearm point of the armhole and lower the whole front... Judging from the cording I would say it is missing height and movement there. So I think there is not enough front length between the forearm points,ehh so to speak...

Cheers, Hendrick

[Kiem]

I am a bit puzzled by these things aswell.

Maybe It is because I removed the back darts on the sleeveless pictures.
And maybe I stood a bit more erect than in the other pictures? I am not completely sure.

I am thinking of making a new muslin sometime soon, incorporating some of the alterations that seem to work so far.
And adjust for the protruding belly in the way Peterle mentioned.
Maybe that will tidy things up a bit. If not It will be a fun (or frustrating) experiment 

[posaune]

no, no it was tilted before too. lg posaune

[pfaff260]

I'm with Posaune, Add some where she tells you to slash the pattern. It seems the breastlenght is to short. This is called armsgatdiepte in Dutch and this is where usually this problem lies.

[Schneiderfrei]

Posaune, I see you have the shirt front slashed at the chest line. Is this because you dont want to change the shape of the sleeve at the front?