Shirt Fitting issues

[Petruchio]

I'm currently working on a draft again, that was previously discussed on the old CaT Forum. Altough I fitted several people, mostly with satisfactorial outcome, there always seem to be some issues with this draft. As a background I use the modern rundschau draft and one of the major alteration was the balance - I added about 3cm to the front (and took the same amount from the back). Also the Bb on the right side is smaller than on the left side since the right shoulder is rolled more forward and the sleevehead was also altered significantly.
Now my main issue is the collar when unbottened; it just don't stand properly and seems to be spreading away.



It looks alright when closed though...



I will post some more pictures of the whole shirt and the fit later.

[peterle]

I think it just needs some more length on the outer edge: slash the collar pattern across from the outer edge to the inner one aproximately in the yoke seam area and open the slash towards the outer edge. The pivot point is on the inner edge. Try an opening of 0,75cm. This alteration will also care for a cleaner collar when closed. Now it has a kink when closed.

[Petruchio]

I think it just needs some more length on the outer edge: slash the collar pattern across from the outer edge to the inner one aproximately in the yoke seam area and open the slash towards the outer edge. The pivot point is on the inner edge. Try an opening of 0,75cm. This alteration will also care for a cleaner collar when closed. Now it has a kink when closed.

Just to be sure... this would look something like this?



Does this require an alteration on the neckhole as well?

[peterle]

No, not the collar stand. Do this only on the collar and keep the stand untouched.

[Petruchio]

Again, some questions on the draft. There are still some small issues I think.

First, note that altough I really try to make the pictures when people stand relaxed, everytime I take a photograph the client is standing overly erect; something that isn't an issue in real life, hence the balance always looks a bit off.

The issues I see are mainly the sleeves. I think the sleeve pitch is ok (not sure though), so I think I just have to alter the shape of the sleeve head. I used the modern rundschau draft, but due to the forward rolled shoulders I moved the shoulder pitch also forward. Secondly, when he's standing still there are almost no visible creases on the shirt front, but everytime he moves just a little bit there are some pulling marks from the shoulder to the first or second shirt button (you can see them a little bit at the first picture of the post as well with the collar closed). I tried to try diffrent buttoning positions and this might mitigate the problem, but nonetheless it doesn't solve it entirely. I, of course know, that a shirt will always crease when the person moves, but I really would know what causes the creases and how to fix them. I have a draft for a diffrent person and the same problem occurs, altough somewhat more significant.

[posaune]

As you see the bust is pulling the fabric up and it pulls at the width best to see in the left sideview. There should be a longer CF maybe 1 cm. The chest could be a bit wider maybe 1.5 cm.  Have you measure the armhole height? ( Rh) Looks a bit close in the armpits. The sleeve cap should be cut out a bit more  - maybe 0.5 cm in front.
and he has a hanging right side.
lg
posaune

[Petruchio]

Thanks posaune. Again, the pulling on the bust is only there, because for whatever reason, he overerects his torso when I take a picture. This is not his normal posture and normally there is no pulling from the bust. The blue shirt in the first post is the exact same pattern and there is no pulling whatsoever. Also, there isn't much of a problem with the chest width altough there are some pulling marks on the pictures.
Actually I measured the depth of the armhole and was aiming for the armhole to be as high as possible. He doesn't fell any tightness in that area, but I will cut it down by 0,5cm.
Concerning the shoulders, it really differs from picture to picture., but the left shoulder is significantly wider than the right one and also the right one is rolled more forward, but I tried to adjust for that, so I already have a asymmetrical pattern (I made a forward shoulder adjustment on the right side).

But I was wondering what causes the pulling from the shoulder to the button on the chest? is this caused by shoulder that is cut too sloped? Should you therefore add fabric at the shoulder?

[posaune]

I would. And maybe doing fitting pics,  better is to button the shirt close. Otherwise you may missing some issues. Par example the left collar tip looks like it is lower than the right.
lg
posaune

[Petruchio]

So this is the latest trial I made. As posaune suggested I added 1,5 cm to the front. After some trial and error I added the extra lenght through the whole chest area, changing the armhole as well, since the "pivoting" method didn't change the pulling lines. There is still some pulling sensation from the chest to the side seam, but all in all I now added more than 6 cm to the front, so I am a little hesitant if this can be right . I also added some width to the chest and reshaped the sleevehead.

[Petruchio]

So I made another shirt up, but there are still some issues. I know I rush to the real stuff too quickly but I need the sewing practice anyway and the shirts are - I hope -at least wearable.

However, as in previous shirts as well, I still think the neckhole is too high. It's hard too see on a picture but the neckhole just looks a little too high, maybe 0,7cm even. I don't know if there is an underlying issue (balance?) there or if I could just cut it a little deeper, also on this particular shirt I think I positioned the buttonhole on the collar a little off, causing the collar stand to fold over the closure and thus the collar tips don't seem to be symmetrical anymore. I think I should also add something at the shoulder and the upper chest, consequently changing the Av-Line, because the whole shoulder is cut a little too close and might cause the small pulling sensations from shoulder to the CF.
I might also let out the shoulder in the front because it seems to be "pulling" forward a little bit. Also after all the balance alterations the back now is significantly shorter than the front.

[peterle]

I think the shirt is pretty good.
Your outer collar edge needs more length yet, it pulls the stand backwards at the button. Maybe the width of collar and stand differ too much. The more difference, the longer the edge of the collar has to be. Its also possible the whole collar (stand and collar) is a bit too short, it seems a bit tight.
cutting, sewing and attaching a collar have to be made very accurately, it helps to do measure and make notches for CB and yoke seams on the collar stand.