Alternative Shoulder Seam Position

[jruley]

Thought I'd try an experiment based on some of the discussions in Dunc's jacket fitting thread.

Reza (International School of Tailoring) says in his video that the one case where fullness in the back shoulder is really wanted is the old fashioned backward slanted shoulder seam.  I've also read about Neopolitan tailors using a more backward seam position on unstructured coats.  My prominent blades require length which results in a shoulder dart with the conventional seam location - or a fair amount of fullness which can't be shrunk away with fabrics like cotton or linen.

So here is the left side of my jacket pattern, with seam allowances removed:

[jruley]

Here I have relocated the back seam, taking about 3/8" from the back neck and 2" at the shoulder; hollowing the seam 3/8" in the middle.  This gets rid of most of the back dart.

The cutoff pieces have been closed to the front.  The scye line will need a little correction.  The neck line will be straightened, bringing it closer to the neck - but if I stretch it a bit that might help put concave shape in the shoulder.



Thinking about trying this on a linen coat.  Would appreciate thoughts from the more knowledgeable.

[TTailor]

I watched Reza's videos and his concepts are interesting to see.
In terms of easing in the back armhole as an alternative to ease in the back shoulder, I'm not 100% sold.
The back ache line is on a straighter area of grain and not easy to shrink a lot in successfully in a hard dry fabric.
Do you fill the hollow with more padding?
Iron work to stretch the fabric vertically for the length lost over the blade is possible but seems like correcting a little for loss at the shoulder when creating a saddle shape.

I'd like to see the corrections on different body types.

The displaced shoulder seam does reduce the amount of ease in the back shoulder seam, but Reza is creating a hollow effect on the top of the shoulder, where you now do not have a seam. Perhaps you can attempt iron work to get it? Much like the ironwork on the top sleeve to create the shaping where the fabric is essentially a fold.

[jruley]

One thing I noticed about Reza's video is he appears to be working with linen.  He could shrink the fullness out of his seams, but couldn't shrink away the resulting "bubble".  So he puts the "bubble" in a less conspicuous place in order to get a better looking shoulder.  With wool, you can probably do more shrinking so the traditional approach works better.

I agree it would be interesting to see the idea on different body types.  Reza looks like he has very hollow shoulders, but that doesn't mean everyone else does.

Terri, I know you've used a similar displaced shoulder seam position in making period costumes.  What's your experience in getting it to fit well?

[Greger]

Poulin's book has a concave in back shoulder seam (3/8 inch) and convex in the front (1/2-inch drop at shoulder end).

The fitting might change it. How you do your canvas can certainly change it. I think some tailors run their canvases over the shoulder more than four inches to skip a shoulder pad. And you don't want the shoulder ends to collapse over time. Always that pristine look. Narrow shoulder people, so their head looks big, some tailors extend the shoulders. The armhole has to be cut correct and the sleeve with it, or it doesn't look good. The canvas makes a difference. For example, you might want to bring the sleeve seam in over the shoulder and have a huge sleeve cap. When done well these are very nice looking. Suggest wool for these that shrinks a lot.