Questions about the angle of the darts on a front jacket pattern

[Enzo]

Hello everyone,

Today I would like to ask the question of the effect of the darts on the front of the jacket pattern on the style of the jacket, the fit etc...
I put you illustrations of the magazine "the progressive tailor" (findable on internet archive) to explain what I am talking about.

To explain my point of view, let's start with a drawing where the two clips are straight (parallel to the front center line), from my point of view it's an intuitive idea, that's how it seems the most natural to draw a garment.


However we often see, most of the time in fact, drawings of jacket fronts with angled darts, on old patterns it's the dart under the chest that is often angled like here:


But in modern methods it is the darts under the armhole, or the seam between the front and the side body that is angled, or very angled!


I don't understand why people do this actually and I wonder if anyone here knows an explanation of this angled cutting methodology, if it has any advantages, disadvantages, special effects of any kind...

Thanks a lot everyone!

[Greger]

My suggestion is to make a muslin without cut darts. Try pining the various kinds and see what it does. And the fact that you will be shrinking the cloth for shape. There is another single darts. Underarm towards center of pocket. Darts moved inwards and/or outwards, too. Some darts are cut after the fitting. It might look good on paper, but does it work for that customer?

[Gerry]

Relative to the hem, the front dart of that 'vintage' draft is straight/perpendicular.

Straight-drop darts make sense with patterned material.

As for the underarm dart, they typically begin at the lowest point of the curve, so that they're tucked out of sight. With more of a flat-base armhole, the dart can be brought forward to the point where the front curve ends. It still ends up being tucked out of sight, but more vertical.

If you look at your final example at the waistline, the angling of the underarm dart creates more equally-spaced suppression. I'm guessing that this is what led to this convention.

Greger's advice is sound. We learn from experimenting.

[Enzo]

Very interesting point about the more even distribution of removal with the angled dart, does it produce a particular effect from your perspective?
Is it a better idea to have the seams at equal distance rather than spaced differently (as in my first example)?
Also it's not my habit but I should do more fitting with test fabrics, I'll suggest this to some friends for practice I think.

[Gerry]

Very interesting point about the more even distribution of removal with the angled dart, does it produce a particular effect from your perspective?

Simply angling the dart doesn't necessarily create more even suppression around the waistline. It's where the widest part of the dart is placed around the waistline that matters; and a more vertical drop can fall at a similar point.

It's more typical with older drafts to see a rounded armscye, rather than flat-base, with the dart beginning at the lowest point of the curve. Hence the more acute angling. Why were things that way? Convention, I'm guessing.
I heard Rezza mention in passing that a flattened base to the armscye results a better sleeve. He didn't elaborate and I simply don't have his experience so can't tell you why. I'm sure he'll get onto this subject eventually in his new video series (subscribe, if you haven't already done so).

Is it a better idea to have the seams at equal distance rather than spaced differently (as in my first example)?

Follow Greger's advice. Make a toile, pin the darts (or baste them), and draw conclusions from your findings.

[Greger]

A lot of pockets are about 5 1/4 inch from the front edge of coat. That as a guide, the darts go in about an inch on each side. This reasoning has been used. Plus you don't want seams piling up. And strength is included.
Another problem is size of breast dart. Depending on style/fashion. Talking about the width. So, this varies. A lot of weight out front doesn't need a dart. Since you are trying to psychology give the person a thinner look you fold the cloth and sew right on its edge for the thinnest dart possible. It's the same trick for trouser hip pockets where a dart is not needed, but gives a "normal" appearance. Sometimes people notice these darts missing and their minds go "haywire". Tailors have lost customers for this reason.