Author Topic: Women's Pants toile fit check  (Read 9058 times)

jruley

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Women's Pants toile fit check
« on: September 05, 2016, 12:02:39 PM »
Over the years my wife has tried several pants patterns with generally poor results.  I recently stumbled across this site and decided to give the pants pattern a try:

http://www.leenas.com/English/contact_information.html
(the link to the actual draft seems to be down at the moment, but I hope will be restored soon).

The first try (not shown) was too tight-fitting to be useful, probably due to her thigh circumference.
I added 2" ease to the hip circumference (in addition to the 4cm in the pattern) and here is the result.  She says it feels comfortable except for pressure at the bottom of the fly.  No pressure in the back at the same level.

Does the pressure mean they need additional crotch depth?  Or should the fronts be hollowed more at the base of the fly?  Or is it something else?
What other issues do the professionals see, and what advice do you have?

Thanks as always,
Jim Ruley









posaune

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2016, 12:51:35 AM »
As you see, your wive needs more crotch diameter, then the fly will come loose. It needs it front (maybe 0.5)  and back (maybe 1 cm) (look at the hip and high line dipping at CB). The crotch can maybe 0.5 cm deeper and the back a bit cupped out.  You must cut the left side a bit wider and higher than the right - good to see on front view.
If you have enlarged the crotch diameter it is possibly you have to take some fabric away from Back side and under the tush.
lg
posaune

jruley

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2016, 09:14:48 AM »
Thank you posaune!
 
Here are some photos of the pattern.  Front laid in place on the back:



Back part by itself:



Front and back in closing position:



Seeing these, is there anything else you would recommend before I try the changes in your last post?


posaune

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2016, 05:20:48 PM »
Just a little (very little) more curvation from hip to waist - more fabric for hip cushions.
pattern looks nice.
It can be - after enlarging the crotch diameter - you must cut the back hip line and let it overlapp maybe 1 cm at crotch seam. So you should let a s.a. about 4 cm at waist back CB tapper to 1 cm reaching hip line.
lg
posaune

jruley

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2016, 09:42:30 PM »
Thanks.

So, to enlarge the crotch diameter, do I just scoop out more front and back?  Or will this make the pants too tight?  Do I need to add a gusset in the inseam from crotch to knee?

Henry Hall

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2016, 11:11:17 PM »
No, extend crotch points, maybe even drop it 0.5cm on back.

jruley

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2016, 12:48:00 AM »
No, extend crotch points, maybe even drop it 0.5cm on back.

Since I didn't leave any inlays, I can't extend the forks the recommended amount.  So, if I want to keep using the same toile it sounds like I will need to add gussets before re-cutting the forks.

I am confused about this part:


It can be - after enlarging the crotch diameter - you must cut the back hip line and let it overlapp maybe 1 cm at crotch seam. So you should let a s.a. about 4 cm at waist back CB tapper to 1 cm reaching hip line.


It sounds like the concern is that extending the back fork may make the back seam too long?  So, does this mean dropping the waist band at CB, tapering to nothing at the side seam?


theresa in tucson

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2016, 01:10:30 AM »
J, over on Stitcher's Guild there is a thread on fitting pants.  You might want to take a look at it.  Also, one of the forum members goes by the handle "More Joy", and she has some interesting thoughts on pant fitting.  She's even got You Tube videos on how to duplicate  the crotch curve.  With women, getting the right balance is difficult because we are more three dimensional than men.  Depth of body usually requires longer crotch extensions either front or back depending on where the bump out is.  Style makes a difference as well.  A trouser is really a bifurcated skirt with a lower crotch curve, whereas a jean is much closer fitted with the crotch curve much closer to the body.

jruley

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2016, 03:16:36 AM »
J, over on Stitcher's Guild there is a thread on fitting pants.  You might want to take a look at it.  Also, one of the forum members goes by the handle "More Joy", and she has some interesting thoughts on pant fitting.  She's even got You Tube videos on how to duplicate  the crotch curve. 

Thanks Theresa.  It looks like there are several threads, quite long, and without knowing anything about the skills of the commentators it's hard to know where to begin.

Can you post a link to the video?  I couldn't find it.

Is there a good published source for fitting women's trousers?  Most of the material in the women's reference section seems pretty dated.

posaune

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2016, 06:12:11 AM »


here you see the alterations. The last one (rotating the upper back part )  is only done, when the back crotch is too long and the back fabric  needs to be go up. Setting the waist band down is not the right thing.
lg
posaune

theresa in tucson

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2016, 10:02:06 AM »
J, a book you might want to look at is by Palmer and Pletsch, Pants for Every Body.  It's pretty good and covers a lot of ground.  They use the tissue fitting method which does not work if you are doing it by yourself.  You, on the other hand are fitting your wife, which makes all the difference in the world. 

The lady's name is Joy Bernhardt.

jruley

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2016, 10:31:40 AM »
J, a book you might want to look at is by Palmer and Pletsch, Pants for Every Body.  It's pretty good and covers a lot of ground.  They use the tissue fitting method which does not work if you are doing it by yourself.  You, on the other hand are fitting your wife, which makes all the difference in the world. 


Thanks again.  How does this compare to "Pants for Real People", a later work by Pati Palmer?  Reviews of both on Amazon are generally favorable.

jruley

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2016, 11:17:51 AM »

here you see the alterations. The last one (rotating the upper back part )  is only done, when the back crotch is too long and the back fabric  needs to be go up. Setting the waist band down is not the right thing.
lg
posaune


Thanks posaune for the diagram, which made the alteration very clear.

Here's what I did.  No left/right or upper back part changes yet.

This is the back fork with an extension pieced on.  The blue chalk line is the new cutting line,  showing the fork extension and a little scooped out of the back.



The front fork:



And here is how they fit.  She says the pressure at bottom of fly has been relieved:









The only thing she doesn't like now is they ride up when she sits down:


Does this mean the thigh is still too tight, or is there another issue?

Henry Hall

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2016, 12:01:39 PM »
Narrow knee?

posaune

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Re: Women's Pants toile fit check
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2016, 06:10:14 PM »
Better but not enough. The dipping of the lines in back is lesser now. You must open the crotch more. I think 1 cm at back crotch only.
The trouser  has not enough back crotch length so it climbs when the back is stressed. Measure the thighs circ at their widest part and compare it to the pants leg. Mostly about 8  - 10 cm from crotch down. The trouser should have at least 4 cm more at this place. And I think they have this.
I would recommend to open one side seam from high hip to crotch height, see how much it gapes and pin it new. It maybe you need only to loose the back - it looks a bit tight and side seam curves a bit. Or more back as front. It is not much maybe 0.7 cm. So  hopefully your seam allowance is sufficient. 
Have you measured waist to floor on 4 sides? Left side  looks higher.
lg
posaune